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Guitar Discussions -> Spontanious Combustion of binding!?
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Spontanious Combustion of binding!? - Twibil - 15:31 11-11-08
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Customer just left with a 1969 Gibson Classical guitar that had
developed an interesting problem: the tortise-shell colored binding
around the edges of the body had self-destructed; turning into an ashy
powder in some places, cracking into tiny chunks elsewhere, and
cracking severely everywhere else.
The edges of the guitar body were stained a warm brown (from the
chemical reaction?), particularly on the top, where the brown color
extended about a inch in from the binding, and the brown color wasn't
on the surface of the finish, but was in the grain of the wood itself!
It looks as if the nitrate plastic of the binding has undergone
partial spontanious combustion, stopping just short of actually
bursting into flame!
(Note: most older guitars were bound with nitrate plastics that can
sometimes become chemically unstable with age, just like older
celluloid movie film that would sometimes go into spontanious
combustion. You occasionally see signs of this decomposition on old
plastic tuner buttons and pickguards as well.)
Anyhow, I wonder if anyone else out there has seen anything like this
before? It's only the second one I've seen in almost 50 years of
guitar work, so it can't be a very common thing, but OTOH if the
binding on this guitar died due to chemical decomposition there are
probably others out there with that same batch of binding that have
done the same thing...
~Pete
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Re: Spontanious Combustion of binding!? - RichL - 15:35 11-11-08
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Twibil <nowayjose6@gmail.com> wrote:
> Customer just left with a 1969 Gibson Classical guitar that had
> developed an interesting problem: the tortise-shell colored binding
> around the edges of the body had self-destructed; turning into an ashy
> powder in some places, cracking into tiny chunks elsewhere, and
> cracking severely everywhere else.
>
> The edges of the guitar body were stained a warm brown (from the
> chemical reaction?), particularly on the top, where the brown color
> extended about a inch in from the binding, and the brown color wasn't
> on the surface of the finish, but was in the grain of the wood itself!
>
> It looks as if the nitrate plastic of the binding has undergone
> partial spontanious combustion, stopping just short of actually
> bursting into flame!
>
> (Note: most older guitars were bound with nitrate plastics that can
> sometimes become chemically unstable with age, just like older
> celluloid movie film that would sometimes go into spontanious
> combustion. You occasionally see signs of this decomposition on old
> plastic tuner buttons and pickguards as well.)
>
> Anyhow, I wonder if anyone else out there has seen anything like this
> before? It's only the second one I've seen in almost 50 years of
> guitar work, so it can't be a very common thing, but OTOH if the
> binding on this guitar died due to chemical decomposition there are
> probably others out there with that same batch of binding that have
> done the same thing...
Nothing that severe, but the binding on my '66 Gretsch Tennessean
(originally cream colored) is very dark in spots and blotchy. It looks
like some of the color from the guitar itself has bled into the binding.
I wouldn't be surprised if the binding was mechanically very weak there
(and elsewhere), but I'm not about to poke it and find out! The wood
itself has retained its color on the surface, but may be degraded
underneath.
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Re: Spontanious Combustion of binding!? - AJ - 16:23 11-11-08
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In article <54d4a27b-9d92-4f2e-8c00-042d039374f1
@a26g2000prf.googlegroups.com>, nowayjose6@gmail.com says...
> Customer just left with a 1969 Gibson Classical guitar that had
> developed an interesting problem: the tortise-shell colored binding
> around the edges of the body had self-destructed; turning into an ashy
> powder in some places, cracking into tiny chunks elsewhere, and
> cracking severely everywhere else.
>
> The edges of the guitar body were stained a warm brown (from the
> chemical reaction?), particularly on the top, where the brown color
> extended about a inch in from the binding, and the brown color wasn't
> on the surface of the finish, but was in the grain of the wood itself!
>
> It looks as if the nitrate plastic of the binding has undergone
> partial spontanious combustion, stopping just short of actually
> bursting into flame!
>
> (Note: most older guitars were bound with nitrate plastics that can
> sometimes become chemically unstable with age, just like older
> celluloid movie film that would sometimes go into spontanious
> combustion. You occasionally see signs of this decomposition on old
> plastic tuner buttons and pickguards as well.)
>
> Anyhow, I wonder if anyone else out there has seen anything like this
> before? It's only the second one I've seen in almost 50 years of
> guitar work, so it can't be a very common thing, but OTOH if the
> binding on this guitar died due to chemical decomposition there are
> probably others out there with that same batch of binding that have
> done the same thing...
>
> ~Pete
>
Dan Erlwine had an article on that in Vintage Guitar, or on the Les Paul
Forum, or maybe in a Stew Mac catalog. I'll have to see if I can find
it, but it was an old multi-layer Gibson tortoise shell pickguard that
was chemically self-destructing and the fumes were eating either the
finish or gold plating, I believe because the guitar was stored in the
case for a long time.
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